Oct 08, 2007 08:41AM GMT
Question
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Politics - United States
Should the government spend $600,000 to change the Swastika-shaped image of naval barracks?
The group of six buildings located were constructed between 1967-70, under a design by local architect John Mock. It wasn't until after the groundbreaking began that Navy officials realized that the buildings would appear as a Nazi Swastika when seen from above, and public knowledge rose considerably with the popularity of aerial photo programs such as Google Earth.http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1&ll=32.676082,-117.15...
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Answered No, don't spend any taxpayer money to change it
You know why? Because I don't think we have a threat of Nazis taking over us, or very many sensitive folk flying over the barracks getting all bent out of shape. You know what? Just plant some big bushy trees...strategically there and there and....there and in a few years the outline will be blurred by vegetation. Ta da. Cheap, easy, and good for the environment. -
Answered Yes, use taxpayer money to modify the barracks
Why not? Far more than $600,000 of our taxes are squandered on far more ridiculous and wasteful projects.
Check out these;
* The federal government cannot account for $24.5 billion spent in 2003.
* A White House review of just a sample of the federal budget identified $90 billion spent on programs deemed that were either ineffective, marginally adequate, or operating under a flawed purpose or design.
* The Congressional Budget Office published a “Budget Options” book identifying $140 billion in potential spending cuts.
* The federal government spends $23 billion annually on special interest pork projects such as grants to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, or funds to combat teenage “goth” culture in Blue Springs, Missouri.
* Washington spends tens of billions of dollars on failed and outdated programs such as the Rural Utilities Service, U.S. Geological Survey and Economic Development Association.
* The federal government made $20 billion in overpayments in 2001.
* The Department of Housing and Urban Development’s $3.3 billion in overpayments in 2001 accounted for over 10 percent of the department’s total budget.
* Over one recent 18-month period, Air Force and Navy personnel used government-funded credit cards to charge at least $102,400 for admission to entertainment events, $48,250 for gambling, $69,300 for cruises, and $73,950 for exotic dance clubs and prostitu...Why not? Far more than $600,000 of our taxes are squandered on far more ridiculous and wasteful projects.
Check out these;
* The federal government cannot account for $24.5 billion spent in 2003.
* A White House review of just a sample of the federal budget identified $90 billion spent on programs deemed that were either ineffective, marginally adequate, or operating under a flawed purpose or design.
* The Congressional Budget Office published a “Budget Options” book identifying $140 billion in potential spending cuts.
* The federal government spends $23 billion annually on special interest pork projects such as grants to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, or funds to combat teenage “goth” culture in Blue Springs, Missouri.
* Washington spends tens of billions of dollars on failed and outdated programs such as the Rural Utilities Service, U.S. Geological Survey and Economic Development Association.
* The federal government made $20 billion in overpayments in 2001.
* The Department of Housing and Urban Development’s $3.3 billion in overpayments in 2001 accounted for over 10 percent of the department’s total budget.
* Over one recent 18-month period, Air Force and Navy personnel used government-funded credit cards to charge at least $102,400 for admission to entertainment events, $48,250 for gambling, $69,300 for cruises, and $73,950 for exotic dance clubs and prostitutes.
* Examples of wasteful duplication include: 342 economic development programs; 130 programs serving the disabled; 130 programs serving at-risk youth; 90 early childhood development programs; 75 programs funding international education, cultural, and training exchange activities; and 72 federal programs dedicated to assuring safe water.
* The Advanced Technology Program spends $150 million annually subsidizing private businesses, and 40% of this goes to Fortune 500 companies.
* The Defense Department wasted $100 million on unused flight tickets, and never bothered to collect refunds even though the tickets were reimbursable.
* The Conservation Reserve program pays farmers $2 billion annually to not farm their land.
* Washington spends $60 billion annually on corporate welfare, versus $43 billion on homeland security.
* The Department of Agriculture spends $12 billion to $30 billion annually on farm subsidies, the vast majority of which go to agribusinesses and farmers averaging $135,000 in annual income.
* Massive farm subsidies also go to several members of Congress, and celebrity “hobby farmers” such as David Rockefeller, Ted Turner, Scottie Pippen, and former Enron CEO Ken Lay.
* The Medicare program pays as much as eight times the cost that other federal agencies pay for the same drugs and medical supplies.
* Congressional investigators were able to receive $55,000 in federal student loan funding for a fictional college they created to test the Department of Education.
* The Army Corps of Engineers has been accused of illegally manipulating data to justify expensive but unnecessary public works projects.
* Food stamp overpayments cost $600 million annually.
* School lunch program abuse costs $120 million annually.
* Veterans’ program overpayments cost $800 million annually.
* Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) overpayments cost $9 billion annually.
* Better tracking of student loan recipients would save $1 billion annually.
* Preventing states from using accounting tricks to secure additional Medicaid funds would save several billion dollars annually.
* Medicare contractors owe the federal government $7 billion.(less) -
Answered No, don't spend any taxpayer money to change it
It never ceases to amaze me what people will think of next LOL. The symbol often referred to as the swastika was around LONG before the Nazi's. It is the solar cross and is held sacred by many, including Celtic Pagans, Native Americans, Buddhists, Hindus, and many more. I wear St. Brigit's cross and it's the solar cross, or equal-armed cross, and symbolizes fertility, birth, re-birth.
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Answered None of the above
So this building is almost 40 years old huh? If you wait a while, it'll be outdated and some senator will lobby for billions to put something else there that the public doesn't need.
I have a swastika tattoo on my left temple, wonder if the Feds would pay to change that?
And lets not forget that Henry Ford Sr. gave millions to Hitler during WWII. Should the Feds not use Ford products? -
and really how many people know that unless you point it out and amake a issue of it. And not all the time either. I have seen both. I just ;looked in a book I have on Symbology and it does goes both ways in ancient works. So as I said unsless you point it out so what
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The enjoyment of critical debate is it does force research.
We find strength and knowledge by facing the 'critical' questions. Yes, I do believe the Bible; and i am not bothered by the people who choose to discount it. Some may say it 's 'phony' literature, fables and no historical significance. Yet, cities mentioned in the Bible that Science and Historians called 'fantasy' have been uncovered by Archeologists.
So, there may be areas we can disagree on philisophically and even theologically, These can be used to encourage learning. The best teachers knew how to be critical enough to challenge both sides of debate. C.S. Lewis wrote other books beyond the fantasy story of Narnia. Dietrich Bon Hoffer lived and wrote during WW2 in Germany, excellent critical thinker.
Ravi Zacharias is a critical teacher debater who speaks at many colleges.
A link to his site is included for your consideration. http://rzim.org/index.php
yes, even when we have heated disagreements, I still admire and respect your debate style and reasoning aspect. -
Okay now I have to ask what cities have they proven from the Bible that were not metioned elsewhere in history. I regularly read Archaelogical finds in that my degrees are in Anthpology and have seen none in reliable non faith affliated journals. And yes I hav eseen the recent data on what may the operative word may have been cities that on a strech might maybe could have been Sodom and Gommorrah but in the end is all they can say is that they are 2 ancient destryed cities, no names no way of how they were destroyed either by mna or by heaven and no pillar of salt. Please the government of Israel allows very little scientific testing on anything found They pretty much disallow all formal dating techniques and state that must be it because the Bible says so.
Yes Lewis wrote olther books but they were still written as Christian Apologist. Bon Hoffer was arrestted and executed in 1943 but many criticakl thuinkers lived in Germnay on both sides of the war, so I am not sure your point there. And Zacharias as Minister starts with an agenda based on Christian belief and finishes with it. -
Do they have to start and end with an atheistic view to be accurate?
I agree that many religious [of all faiths] can be and are ''bias''.
That is the problem with human nature. "i'' does not like to be 'wrong' nor 'challenged'.
The fact that a city is named in the Bible does not mean the city is fabled. Ur of the Chaldeean era was considered myth until the 1900's. Some of the 'theatric' script can be debated but not being sure does not make it false.
I was not going to mention Sodom and Gommorrah, because I think they are 'close' but not yet found. The Bible states that the surrounding towns were also laid waste. Even if this was a 'natural' occurance, the 'timing' of Lots' escape is interesting.
We both acknowledge that Hinduism, Buddhism, and assorted other 'faiths' are or could be 'false'. Yet, why do we not get bent out of shape over these or even the Wiccans.?
When the term 'Christian' comes up, people [both sides] hit 'defence and attack mode'.
If Christianity is just a silly faith about some teacher who got himself killed, who cares ? We teach mythical Greek in schools, what's the difference?
But if the Resurrection of this 'teacher' is true, then it does deserve consideration. See, this is where the Christian faith stands or falls. When Jesus was buried, all the nation of Rome had to do was draw up the dead body of Jesus after 4 days. One crucified corpse would have stopped Christianity that day.
Even non Christian writers of that era acknowledg...Do they have to start and end with an atheistic view to be accurate?
I agree that many religious [of all faiths] can be and are ''bias''.
That is the problem with human nature. "i'' does not like to be 'wrong' nor 'challenged'.
The fact that a city is named in the Bible does not mean the city is fabled. Ur of the Chaldeean era was considered myth until the 1900's. Some of the 'theatric' script can be debated but not being sure does not make it false.
I was not going to mention Sodom and Gommorrah, because I think they are 'close' but not yet found. The Bible states that the surrounding towns were also laid waste. Even if this was a 'natural' occurance, the 'timing' of Lots' escape is interesting.
We both acknowledge that Hinduism, Buddhism, and assorted other 'faiths' are or could be 'false'. Yet, why do we not get bent out of shape over these or even the Wiccans.?
When the term 'Christian' comes up, people [both sides] hit 'defence and attack mode'.
If Christianity is just a silly faith about some teacher who got himself killed, who cares ? We teach mythical Greek in schools, what's the difference?
But if the Resurrection of this 'teacher' is true, then it does deserve consideration. See, this is where the Christian faith stands or falls. When Jesus was buried, all the nation of Rome had to do was draw up the dead body of Jesus after 4 days. One crucified corpse would have stopped Christianity that day.
Even non Christian writers of that era acknowledge that.(less) -
No but it shopuld start with some basis in reality and not conjecture or fairy tale. Science not belief. Yiou stated about Cities being found that the Bible talks about that is a science Archaeology. Yet you named none. Ur was not really considered myth because more than one instance of it's existence was given. And theer were 2 Ur's in the recods one the babylonian City and one the Chaldean. So piock one. I am from Philly and there is an exceelent history and collection about UR at the University Museum of PA Museum and it pretty much dispenses with the Biblical ideas and myths.
s for your arguement that other faith scan be false I agree 100% I think man has well evolved past the need for superstitions and make believe. Like a human child they were fine in our yuth as a species. But they unlike the Judeo/Christian?Islam line of religions do not foster the intolerance and hate and muder fround there from the beginning to today.
The nation iof Roman in judea had not intetrest in the is so called Christ at all. This was all told long after the facts. You want a fact of Rome at that thime. They would not have crucified Christ. That was only used for armed rebellion against theEmpire. So even that part of the Bible gets historical fact wrong. And Rome was a nation of laws that held to them in that era. Pilate ould have been tried by Rome for that criminal act. -
i consider your reasons. But, you are so determined to not consider the 'probability' of a source that you dislike. I grant i do not have college degrees; i thank we both know some with college degrees that need refunds.
We can find intolerance enough in any philosophy or opinion. The intolerance of some does not make the philosophy false.
It is safe to say that niether of us was around at the time of the various texts and cities of that era. Together we have to disect and decipher the fragments and come up with feasible conclusions. I am willing to consider even conclusions I disagree with. They make me research beyond my own beliefs.
No, i am not going to fish for cities that were or were not named, because you have already decided your argument without room for research. You say you have the sources of research. i do not challenge that. I respect your learned knowledge. -
Mr Walden you made statements alluding tio the truth of what is in the Bible more than once, Your most recent was about Cities that scientist have found I asked what those cies were and like all good believers you avoided the questions and made other nion related statements. Everytime you have brought up a supposed truith from the Bible I was able to refute it with either Scientific or Historical fact.
Using one susepect text that has nor proof of it's own existence nor of what it claims to be is not a veifiable source. It is a cultural muth of one small insignificant nomadic tribe that today's Christians have latched onto with bloodsucking fervor in a play to give them validity and continuity. Please either back up your statemensts and allegations or admit there is no proof to them and that like it or not my case has more validity and truth. -
raves +1
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Answered No, don't spend any taxpayer money to change it
Spend the money to feel the poor American citizens.